[Ger-Poland-Volhynia] german russians?

[Jürgen Kaut]

not the case with my family
my father was born in poland, north of chelm, he certainly always thought of 
himself as german, his mother told him he was german, not polish or russian. 
my grandfather was born near radom, poland about 1870 and the family spoke 
german at home and polish in the street, my father learned german growing up 
in a german village in poland and spoke polish only outside of his home
see ya, jurgen

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Krampetz at aol.com>
To: <ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org>
Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2011 1:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] german russians?


> Most Germanic peoples that had spread out of East & West Prussia
> had no sense of nationality.   My own Grandfather, born in  1884
> near Lipno,  gave his 'nationality' as Russian when he emigrated
> in 1904.  But he spoke on Russian, or Polish.  He spoke  German,
> hence he was "ethnically" German as decided by the emigration
> officials.
> Poland, until 1796 was a huge country.  Covering all of today's
> Poland, Ukraine, Belarus, Lithuania, Estonia (what'd I forget?)
> Russia, Austria and Prussia spilt up control then, and not until
> around 1860, did Russia begin demanding Russian as the language
> of their piece.  Eventually, the Germans (and the slave I'm  sure)
> began thinking of themselves as "Russian", Ethnically German,
> and living in Russian controlled Poland.   It'd be interesting  to
> know how the 'common' person there then,  considered themselves.
>
> I recently spoke with another researcher who's grandfather was
> from the same area but came a bit later,   before WWI.
> He told me his grandfather, another German only speaker,  had
> never heard the word Germany and thought he was Russian until
> he arrived in the U.S.
>
> There is a book I'd like to get and read that addresses this
> rising sense of nation-hood and nationality, titled:
> Germans, Poles, and Jews: The Nationality Conflict  in the Prussian East,
> 1772-1914 -
> It's at Amazon.com,  used for $50 & up.
>
> Bob K.
>
>
> In a message dated 02/10/11 11:05:49 A.M. Pacific Standard Time,
> wjmilner at shaw.ca writes:
>
> A funny  thing happened when I started researching my mother's side of
> the family  and discovered she was born in Rovno, Poland.  Looking
> through Polish  history as found in various publications, there wasn't
> much, if any,  mention of an ethnic German population.  Same thing for
> Ukrainian  history when I found  Rovno  was a city  in post war  Ukraine.
> I was somewhat confused, but over time I discovered my  mother was a
> Wandering Volhynian.   Other  discoveries:
>
> The Partitioning of Poland
> German Migration to  Volhynia
> The Peace Treaty of Brest-Litovsk.
> Polish-Soviet War  1919-1920.
> The Aftermath of  World War 1 and Revolution in  Russia
> World War 2 and relocation.
>
> Before all of this, I just told  my Ukrainian friends my mother was
> German speaking, born in present day  Ukraine, but was German, not
> Ukrainian. She came to Canada with her  parents in 1907.  Now I just say
> they were ethnic Germans because  Germany didn't become a country until
> 1871.  Historically, ethnic  Germans from Volhynia were Russian and then
> Polish citizens until WW  2.
>
> For some additional interest about citizenship  visit:
>
> http://members.shaw.ca/d_y_g/5florentine.htm
>
> History has  a way to focus only on the subject of interest and some of
> the people  spoken to by Gabrielle held that focus.
>
> Yours truly,
>
> Jack  Milner
>
>
>
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