[Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Lying about age on shp's passenger list

[Frederick Raudat]

I have found that in both Irish genealogy and with Polish genealogy, that
quite often people didn't know their birthdates.  A woman who worked with
some Polish records with me explained it to me this way.  She grew up in
Poland and had been in a work camp during the war.  She said midwives often
were reporting the information to the rural village parish or later the
civil body.  Sometimes it didn't get recorded and it wasn't necessarily
considered that important by people.  She explained, you were here, that's
all you knew.  

People had different reasons: My great grandfather's first wife was 8 years
older than he and she had been married before and had a son.  On the ship
manifest, she is give the age 46 at the time she came here. He was 38.I have
his baptismal record for Ostpreussen. On her burial record in the cemetery
when she died a year after coming here, her age was listed 39, the same age
as he was that year. 

I have an Irish great great grandfather who I have an age range for.  His
age is different every time.  His death record indicates he was 80 having
been born in 1813, but census records indicate a range of up to ten years
later.  Why?  They were illiterate for one thing.  For another his second
wife was almost 20 years his junior.  His name also has variations from
Mara, Murray, Marrow, Murrow, Marra.  People quite often didn't know.  They
might know a range, but it just wasn't considered that important.  Would you
know how old you were if someone hadn't told you?  There are not a lot of
Irish records in existence for before the 19th century.  And trying to find
a tombstone for some of this people just won't happen.  They don't exist.
Some Irish didn't want as they thought the person purchasing such would be
next, or could not afford tombstones, while others felt quite the opposite
and often times you will see the phrase 'erected by so and so' etched in
them.  Before this man died in CT, he transferred his farm to his son and
the deed says with 'promise of a Christian burial.'

Then of course there is human error in recording and hearing and perhaps
accents to complicate things.  Even clergy recording spellings in old German
records were often spelling phonetically and not always accurate.

-----Original Message-----
From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org
[mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Nelson
Itterman
Sent: Friday, December 01, 2006 3:07 PM
To: 'Carolyn Schott'; ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Lying about age on shp's passenger list

Are you sure you are not looking at another person?
Nelson

-----Original Message-----
From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org
[mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Carolyn
Schott
Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 7:05 PM
To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Lying about age on shp's passenger list

You know - this is actually one of the things that bothers me about my
specific entry!  My g-grandmother would have been 16 at the time, but it
appears that her age is listed as being 9.  It seems difficult to believe
that a 16-year-old could have passed as a 9 year old!  

But I've searched a bit through the village church records, and it doesn't
appear there were any other siblings (of her in-laws) with her name about
age 9 that it might have been instead of my g-grandma.  But since ALL the
ages are off - it's hard to be certain.

And this ship's list has no other info to match up as another person
suggested.

Sigh...

Carolyn

>Message: 3
>Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 15:29:09 -0800
>From: Jack Leigh <jack.leigh at shaw.ca>
>Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Lying about age on ship's passenger
>	list
>To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
>Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20061129152909.00b17de8 at shawmail>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>
>This is a subject I've often wondered about.
>
>My grandparents, and their two children, my father and his 
>sister, all have their ages recorded incorrectly on their 
>return to Canada from a trip "home" to England in 1914.
>
>At the time, their ages were 35, 38, 8, and 4 for my 
>grandfather, grandmother, father, and aunt respectively.  The 
>passenger list records them as 37, 35, 12, and 11.
>
>My grandfather was a Minister in the Anglican Church of Canada 
>and I know he would have had a hard time being dishonest, the 
>family was literate, and the English language wasn't a problem 
>since they were all English/Canadian.
> But perhaps they wanted my grandmother to be known as younger 
>than her husband.  However, I can't think of any advantage in 
>having the children's ages recorded as so much older than they 
>were, nor can I see how anyone would be fooled by a four year 
>old being passed off as eleven.
>
>All the rest of the information in their passenger entries is correct.
>
>So my only explanation is just plain human error in recording.
>
>                          ......... Jack


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