[Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 59, Issue 27
joanp
jkcp at myclearwave.net
Thu Apr 24 10:00:37 PDT 2008
Steve plays the Bass and Trombone. They are playing at the Old Log Theater
of June 2nd. There is some talk of Pikals taking a trip to go see them
there. Hope I will be included!
----- Original Message -----
From: <ger-poland-volhynia-request at eclipse.sggee.org>
To: <ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org>
Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2008 11:22 AM
Subject: Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 59, Issue 27
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: families Heine and Wenzel migrated back to Germany
> 11/1943 (Karl Krueger)
> 2. Re: EWZ Files & Deportation to Siberia (Karl Krueger)
> 3. Re: post WWI immigration, found something in Germany?
> (Jerry Frank)
> 4. Re: Why Did They Leave? (Howard Krushel)
> 5. Re: EWZ Files & Deportation to Siberia (Kyle Sattler)
> 6. Re: EWZ Files & Deportation to Siberia (Karl Krueger)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2008 19:46:14 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Karl Krueger <dabookk54 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] families Heine and Wenzel migrated
> back to Germany 11/1943
> To: Paul Rakow <rakow at ifh.de>, ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
> Message-ID: <163261.17005.qm at web55309.mail.re4.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> You cannot order EWZ50 films from the Family History Centers. Only EWZ57
> and 58 can be ordered through your FHC. For EWZ50-54 you need to go to the
> US National ARchives or get access through the Bundesarchiv.
>
> Paul Rakow <rakow at ifh.de> wrote: Nelson, Nicolas,
>
> Yes, you can see some of the EWZ films through the Mormon
> Family History Centers in Germany without any problems (I've done
> that when I was living in Bayern). I believe it is also possible
> through the Bundesarchiv, but that way has more Datenschutz to
> struggle with.
>
> Nicolas, there are detailed government records on Germans from
> Russia who migrated to Germany - EWZ, Einwandererzentralstelle.
> You can read more about these records at
>
> http://leitfaden.wolhynien.de/guide.pdf
> (deutsche)
> or
> http://www.volhynia.com/ewzmain.html
> (English)
> You should find information there on your Heine and Wenzel
> relatives.
>
> Paul Rakow
> rakow at ifh.de
>
>
> "Nelson Itterman" wrote:
>>
>> Hello Nicolas & Gary:
>> Looks like an EWZ search would probably help. Can he get the EWZ films in
>> Germany?
>> Nelson
>>
>>
>> Nicolas Heine wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> does anybody know something about families Heine and/or Wenzel that
>>> lived in Popraska and Dubowez near Schitomit. They migrated back to
>>> Germany in November 1943.
>>>
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Nicolas Heine
>>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by
> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org
> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
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> now.
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2008 19:58:52 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Karl Krueger <dabookk54 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] EWZ Files & Deportation to Siberia
> To: Nelson Itterman <colnels at telus.net>, "'Kyle Sattler'"
> <kylesattler at sasktel.net>, ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
> Message-ID: <924011.14010.qm at web55304.mail.re4.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> Kyle and Nelson,
> Film #2098666 is a EWZ57 film. You will get little useful information
> from this other than where to look for your potential relatives in EWZ58
> and even that can be a guessing game.
>
> A better way to go is to check ODL and search for Zietz names in EWZ50 -
> select "War Records" under Data category. You will see virtually all Zietz
> are found on EWZ50 film J044 but none are from Ekaterinoslav. You can only
> get EWZ50 records by someone making copies for you at the US National
> Archives.
> Karl
>
> Nelson Itterman <colnels at telus.net> wrote:
> To Kyle & Karl:
> There is one EWZ film #2098666 which will have the listing of all the
> Zietz
> names. It would help if you have other names that show a relationship with
> the Zietz family. If any of the Zietz's registered as immigrants any time
> between 1939 and 1945, they would have to fill out forms showing their
> immediate family their parents and probably grandparents. This is the
> application stage, before they are granted any status. It is worth a try.
> If
> you find the names of ancestors, you then apply for follow up films that
> would have more details. You could be very lucky.
> Nelson
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org
> [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of Karl
> Krueger
> Sent: February-12-08 7:33 PM
> To: Kyle Sattler; ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] EWZ Files & Deportation to Siberia
>
> Dear Kyle,
> To learn what EWZ is all about read this link.
> http://www.volhynia.com/ewzmain.html
>
> EWZ would only be helpful for you if your relatives were met by the German
> troops and then they were naturalized as German citizens.
> Karl
>
> Kyle Sattler wrote: Hello SGGEE members,
>
> I am asking for some help on my Zietz family from Ekaterinoslav, Russia
> (southern Ukraine). They were German Russians. My great-great grandfather,
> Bernhard Zietz (originally Sietz?) and his family immigrated in December
> 1923-January 1924 as I have mentioned in previous postings. His father,
> Peter, died in 1916 in Russia.
>
> Bernhard's mother and siblings were still in Ekaterinoslav during WWII.
> I was wondering what records might be available for deportations to
> Siberia
> or EWZ files. I am not really familiar with EWZ files but I believe that
> they were recorded for German Russians during WWII? Did they include the
> German Russians that got deported to Siberia to work in the salt mines?
>
> I have been told that one of Bernhard's brothers, Aloysius, was killed
> by revolutionists during the Russian Revolution as he was a student at the
> university of Moscow. I understand that they were prime targets for
> Revolutionists. Another brother, George, died at a young age. Bernhard
> helped George's widow immigrate to Canada. From her he found out that his
> mother, Regina (Malinovsky) Zietz and a brother, Joseph, were sent to
> Siberia to work in the salt mines there.
> Bernhard's mother, Regina, was 71 at the time of her deportation. I would
> think that she would be unable to do much labour in salt mines at that
> age?
>
> If someone could help me out on this subject, that would be greatly
> appreciated!
>
> Greetings from the Saskatchewan winter,
>
> Kyle Sattler
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in
> Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at
> http://www.sggee.org/listserv
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German Genealogy in
> Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at
> http://www.sggee.org/listserv
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
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> now.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2008 20:44:42 -0600
> From: Jerry Frank <FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca>
> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] post WWI immigration, found
> something in Germany?
> To: George Shoning <shoning at q.com>,
> ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
> Message-ID: <0JZT0062N6D18A50 at l-daemon>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
> George,
>
> I knew I had seen it somewhere before. I was so focused on the
> Russian Poland reference that I forgot about Volhynia. It is
> located about 6 km SE of Lutsk. Unfortunately I don't see anything
> like it Uznovka nearby.
>
>
> Jerry Frank - Calgary, Alberta
> FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca
>
>
>
>
> At 08:34 PM 23/04/2008, George Shoning wrote:
>>According to Ulrich Mertens' "Handbuch Russland-Deutsche (Mit
>>Ortsverzeichnis Ehemaliger Siedlungsgebiete), there are several
>>variants in the Lutsk area:
>>
>>Podhaitsch (Podhajcy), Southeast of Lutsk
>>Podhaitsch (Antoniewka-Podhaizy)
>>Podhaitsch Kolonie (Podhaje Kolonie)
>>Neu Podhaitsche (Neu-Podhajce)
>>Neu Podhajce
>>
>>George Shoning
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>----------
>>
>> > Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2008 20:13:25 -0600
>> > From: FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca
>> > To: garynrho at mts.net; ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
>> > Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] post WWI immigration, found
>> something in Germany?
>> >
>> > I cannot find Pohajce or equivalent anywhere in Poland. There is an
>> > Osnowka NE of Warsaw but that area is not known to have German
>> > settlements.
>> >
>> > I wish I could be more helpful. I can say that the Reichshof
>> > mentioned below was in Galicia, not Russian Poland.
>> >
>> >
>> > Jerry Frank - Calgary, Alberta
>> > FranklySpeaking at shaw.ca
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > At 10:18 AM 23/04/2008, gary and rhonda simpson wrote:
>> > >Rudolph's naturalization file gives his birthplace as U(O)snov(w)ka,
>> > >Pohajce, Poland(Russia), lettered brackets are difficult to discern.
>> > >so
>> > >this is a possiblily.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >Joe Wrote:There is also a Reichshof that was once in Germany,
>> now in Poland.
>> > >See Multimap at http://www.jewishgen.org/Communities/LocTown.asp
>> > >
>> > >Now called Rzeszow.
>> > >
>> > >Joe in Texas
>> > >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2008 21:52:40 -0600
> From: "Howard Krushel" <krushelh at telus.net>
> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Why Did They Leave?
> To: "'Richard Benert'" <benovich at imt.net>, "'Ger-Poland-Volhynia
> List'" <ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org>
> Message-ID: <000001c8a5be$a4fccf60$86c9bfcc at D24VBP91>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Dick:
> This 1892law and the subsequent clamp down likely explains why so many of
> the land contracts were not written up and registered; something I
> discovered while searching for Land contracts in the Archives; but then it
> seems there was always another regulation or law on the books for most
> every
> thing which then necessitated a bribe to a Czarist Bureaucrat in order to
> have him look the other way.
> Howard Krushel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org
> [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf Of
> Richard
> Benert
> Sent: Wednesday, April 23, 2008 12:28 PM
> To: Jerry Frank; Darrel Goth; Ger-Poland-Volhynia List
> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Why Did They Leave?
>
>
> We know that the government (or rather some
> officials) tried to clamp down on German landholding in Volhynia (again)
> in
> 1907. Between 1901 and 1907, says Kostiuk, 8043 colonists were accused of
> violating the 1892 law forbidding rental of land by Germans. But of these
> cases, only 503 actually made it to court
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2008 08:27:03 -0600
> From: Kyle Sattler <kylesattler at sasktel.net>
> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] EWZ Files & Deportation to Siberia
> To: SGGEE Mailing List <ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org>
> Message-ID: <481098B7.80705 at sasktel.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Hi Karl and Nelson,
>
> I have looked into the EWZ files on Odessa 3 just the other day. On
> the J044 film that Karl mentioned, I found no Zietz families from
> Ekaterinoslav but I did find several Zitz families from Eichwald,
> Gottland and Neuhof. These are all in the vicinity of where the Zietz
> family lived. I will look into getting copies. I had also searched the
> other EWZ and found some more Zietz and Zitz families from around
> Gottland.
>
> Thanks for the help,
>
> Kyle
>
> Karl Krueger wrote:
>> Kyle and Nelson,
>> Film #2098666 is a EWZ57 film. You will get little useful information
>> from this other than where to look for your potential relatives in
>> EWZ58 and even that can be a guessing game.
>>
>> A better way to go is to check ODL and search for Zietz names in EWZ50
>> - select "War Records" under Data category. You will see virtually all
>> Zietz are found on EWZ50 film J044 but none are from Ekaterinoslav.
>> You can only get EWZ50 records by someone making copies for you at the
>> US National Archives.
>> Karl
>>
>> */Nelson Itterman <colnels at telus.net>/* wrote:
>>
>> To Kyle & Karl:
>> There is one EWZ film #2098666 which will have the listing of all
>> the Zietz
>> names. It would help if you have other names that show a
>> relationship with
>> the Zietz family. If any of the Zietz's registered as immigrants
>> any time
>> between 1939 and 1945, they would have to fill out forms showing
>> their
>> immediate family their parents and probably grandparents. This is the
>> application stage, before they are granted any status. It is worth
>> a try. If
>> you find the names of ancestors, you then apply for follow up
>> films that
>> would have more details. You could be very lucky.
>> Nelson
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org
>> [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf
>> Of Karl
>> Krueger
>> Sent: February-12-08 7:33 PM
>> To: Kyle Sattler; ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
>> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] EWZ Files & Deportation to Siberia
>>
>> Dear Kyle,
>> To learn what EWZ is all about read this link.
>> http://www.volhynia.com/ewzmain.html
>>
>> EWZ would only be helpful for you if your relatives were met by
>> the German
>> troops and then they were naturalized as German citizens.
>> Karl
>>
>> Kyle Sattler wrote: Hello SGGEE members,
>>
>> I am asking for some help on my Zietz family from Ekaterinoslav,
>> Russia
>> (southern Ukraine). They were German Russians. My great-great
>> grandfather,
>> Bernhard Zietz (originally Sietz?) and his family immigrated in
>> December
>> 1923-January 1924 as I have mentioned in previous postings. His
>> father,
>> Peter, died in 1916 in Russia.
>>
>> Bernhard's mother and siblings were still in Ekaterinoslav during
>> WWII.
>> I was wondering what records might be available for deportations
>> to Siberia
>> or EWZ files. I am not really familiar with EWZ files but I
>> believe that
>> they were recorded for German Russians during WWII? Did they
>> include the
>> German Russians that got deported to Siberia to work in the salt
>> mines?
>>
>> I have been told that one of Bernhard's brothers, Aloysius, was
>> killed
>> by revolutionists during the Russian Revolution as he was a
>> student at the
>> university of Moscow. I understand that they were prime targets for
>> Revolutionists. Another brother, George, died at a young age.
>> Bernhard
>> helped George's widow immigrate to Canada. From her he found out
>> that his
>> mother, Regina (Malinovsky) Zietz and a brother, Joseph, were sent to
>> Siberia to work in the salt mines there.
>> Bernhard's mother, Regina, was 71 at the time of her deportation.
>> I would
>> think that she would be unable to do much labour in salt mines at
>> that age?
>>
>> If someone could help me out on this subject, that would be greatly
>> appreciated!
>>
>> Greetings from the Saskatchewan winter,
>>
>> Kyle Sattler
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German
>> Genealogy in
>> Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at
>> http://www.sggee.org/listserv
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------
>> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo!
>> Search.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German
>> Genealogy in
>> Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at
>> http://www.sggee.org/listserv
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try
>> it now.
>> <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51733/*http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ%20>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2008 09:15:53 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Karl Krueger <dabookk54 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] EWZ Files & Deportation to Siberia
> To: Kyle Sattler <kylesattler at sasktel.net>, SGGEE Mailing List
> <ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org>
> Message-ID: <682821.59238.qm at web55313.mail.re4.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> To get more out of how to read the results from ODL look at the frame
> numbers. Any names that have the same frame number are on the same page
> meaning they should be in the same family. Then by looking at their
> birthdates you should be able to predict who was a grandparent / parent /
> child. This info is taken from a "Stammblatt" and normally gives 3
> generations of information.
>
> I am thinking it might be good for me to write an article in an upcoming
> journal to better understand all the information ODL shows for their EWZ
> results. When you know what you are looking at you almost don't even need
> the record since much of it is given in their database. It is only because
> I know EWZ so well that I can "read between the lines" of these results.
> It would be good for me to teach others to have this skill too.
> Karl
>
> Kyle Sattler <kylesattler at sasktel.net> wrote:
> Hi Karl and Nelson,
>
> I have looked into the EWZ files on Odessa 3 just the other day. On
> the J044 film that Karl mentioned, I found no Zietz families from
> Ekaterinoslav but I did find several Zitz families from Eichwald,
> Gottland and Neuhof. These are all in the vicinity of where the Zietz
> family lived. I will look into getting copies. I had also searched the
> other EWZ and found some more Zietz and Zitz families from around
> Gottland.
>
> Thanks for the help,
>
> Kyle
>
> Karl Krueger wrote:
>> Kyle and Nelson,
>> Film #2098666 is a EWZ57 film. You will get little useful information
>> from this other than where to look for your potential relatives in
>> EWZ58 and even that can be a guessing game.
>>
>> A better way to go is to check ODL and search for Zietz names in EWZ50
>> - select "War Records" under Data category. You will see virtually all
>> Zietz are found on EWZ50 film J044 but none are from Ekaterinoslav.
>> You can only get EWZ50 records by someone making copies for you at the
>> US National Archives.
>> Karl
>>
>> */Nelson Itterman /* wrote:
>>
>> To Kyle & Karl:
>> There is one EWZ film #2098666 which will have the listing of all
>> the Zietz
>> names. It would help if you have other names that show a
>> relationship with
>> the Zietz family. If any of the Zietz's registered as immigrants
>> any time
>> between 1939 and 1945, they would have to fill out forms showing their
>> immediate family their parents and probably grandparents. This is the
>> application stage, before they are granted any status. It is worth
>> a try. If
>> you find the names of ancestors, you then apply for follow up
>> films that
>> would have more details. You could be very lucky.
>> Nelson
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org
>> [mailto:ger-poland-volhynia-bounces at eclipse.sggee.org] On Behalf
>> Of Karl
>> Krueger
>> Sent: February-12-08 7:33 PM
>> To: Kyle Sattler; ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
>> Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] EWZ Files & Deportation to Siberia
>>
>> Dear Kyle,
>> To learn what EWZ is all about read this link.
>> http://www.volhynia.com/ewzmain.html
>>
>> EWZ would only be helpful for you if your relatives were met by
>> the German
>> troops and then they were naturalized as German citizens.
>> Karl
>>
>> Kyle Sattler wrote: Hello SGGEE members,
>>
>> I am asking for some help on my Zietz family from Ekaterinoslav,
>> Russia
>> (southern Ukraine). They were German Russians. My great-great
>> grandfather,
>> Bernhard Zietz (originally Sietz?) and his family immigrated in
>> December
>> 1923-January 1924 as I have mentioned in previous postings. His
>> father,
>> Peter, died in 1916 in Russia.
>>
>> Bernhard's mother and siblings were still in Ekaterinoslav during
>> WWII.
>> I was wondering what records might be available for deportations
>> to Siberia
>> or EWZ files. I am not really familiar with EWZ files but I
>> believe that
>> they were recorded for German Russians during WWII? Did they
>> include the
>> German Russians that got deported to Siberia to work in the salt
>> mines?
>>
>> I have been told that one of Bernhard's brothers, Aloysius, was killed
>> by revolutionists during the Russian Revolution as he was a
>> student at the
>> university of Moscow. I understand that they were prime targets for
>> Revolutionists. Another brother, George, died at a young age. Bernhard
>> helped George's widow immigrate to Canada. From her he found out
>> that his
>> mother, Regina (Malinovsky) Zietz and a brother, Joseph, were sent to
>> Siberia to work in the salt mines there.
>> Bernhard's mother, Regina, was 71 at the time of her deportation.
>> I would
>> think that she would be unable to do much labour in salt mines at
>> that age?
>>
>> If someone could help me out on this subject, that would be greatly
>> appreciated!
>>
>> Greetings from the Saskatchewan winter,
>>
>> Kyle Sattler
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German
>> Genealogy in
>> Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at
>> http://www.sggee.org/listserv
>>
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------
>> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo!
>> Search.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by Society for German
>> Genealogy in
>> Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org Mailing list info at
>> http://www.sggee.org/listserv
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try
>> it now.
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ger-Poland-Volhynia Mailing List hosted by
> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org
> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it
> now.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ger-Poland-Volhynia mailing list, hosted by the:
> Society for German Genealogy in Eastern Europe http://www.sggee.org
> Mailing list info at http://www.sggee.org/listserv.html
>
>
> End of Ger-Poland-Volhynia Digest, Vol 59, Issue 27
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>
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