[Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Re: Germans conscripted into Russian military 1904ff

[Royal Natzke]

I am seeking information re: Germans in Russian military service prior 
to WWI. What kind of treatment were they given? What kind of 
assignments? etc. My father, Edward Carl Neumann, was born in the 
village of Mariendorf I, Vladimir Volynsk, Polish Kolony Swosczowka. 
It's present day name is Swiychev, northwest of Tumin, Ukraine. I was 
able to obtain his and his brother, Rudolph's, military records from 
Moscow. Rudolph died, according to the records, of pluerisy in a 
military hospital in Moscow. I am assuming he's buried in a military 
cemetery in Moscow. I haven't pursued this data as yet.
My father entered the service in 1904 and was discharged in1909. I 
wonder why he was drafted into service at age 21 instead of the usual 
18. He and his brother both "enlisted as a choral musician in the 
musiacian detachment of the Grenadier Sapper Battaloin of His Highness 
Grand Duke Peter Nikolaevich, quartered in Moscow and formed part of the 
Grenadier Corps."
I have been told by relatives that he played the coronet, but he never 
spoke of this in my recollections. I'm wondering where he would have 
learned this instrument to be proficient enough to qualify for this 
duty. Could he have learned it in a church band?
The village church was Lutheran. Would some of their other duties 
include being body guards for the Czar or some type of security work? If 
anyone has info or could direct me as to where it might be avaiable, I 
would be most appreciative.
Dorothy Natzke
ger-poland-volhynia-request at eclipse.sggee.org wrote:

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>Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Re: Poland Map (Jerry Frank)
>   2. Re: Volhynian village - Slabutkaj ? (Jerry Frank)
>   3. Needs translation from German to English (JUSTIN L DINGMAN)
>   4. RE: Volhynian village - Slabutkaj ? (Jan Textor)
>   5. Re: Volhynian village - Slabutkaj ? (Bill Fife)
>   6. Re: Needs translation from German to
>       English ( Richard Benert)
>
>--__--__--
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 22:22:29 -0700
>From: Jerry Frank <jkfrank at shaw.ca>
>Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Poland Map
>To: Dick Rossin <rdrossin at jvlnet.com>, Ger-Poland-Volhynia
>  <ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org>
>
>While your question appears to be short and simple, there are several 
>points that need to be dealt with.
>
>First - you want an English map.  The only maps I have ever seen of Poland 
>(aside from US Army maps) are in German, Polish, or Russian.  Generally 
>speaking, it is fairly easy to figure out what you are looking at and to 
>read the place names which should be the same in any language (with the 
>exception that Germany occupied a lot of Poland and changed numerous places 
>to Germanic sounding names).
>
>Second, what detail are you expecting from a wall or folded size map?  At 
>1;750,000 scale, typical for a map of that size, you will not find much 
>detail and many villages are not included.  Such maps are available in 
>larger bookstores.  In order to get enough detail to show most of the 
>villages, you need at the very least a 1:300,000 map but better would be 
>1:200,000.  Going to 1:100,000 or better will get you virtually every 
>village.  However, to get these in a wall map would require a wall about 
>7.5ft wide x 7 ft. high for 1:300,000 or 13 ft x 11.5 ft. for 1:200,000.
>
>Third, perhaps you meant to ask for only a part of Poland rather than the 
>whole thing.  Such maps are available from Genealogy Unlimited or the 
>Library of Congress, as already mentioned in other responses.
>
>I think the Library of Congress will provide free copies of parts of maps 
>that show a specific village you want.  However, for a complete map of the 
>size you are talking you will have to pay.
>
>
>At 04:22 PM 14/01/2003 -0600, Dick Rossin wrote:
>  
>
>>Does anyone know where I can obtain a map of Poland from around 1900 that has
>>the names of the towns and villages in English? I would prefer a wall map but
>>a folded map will do. Thanks for any info.
>>    
>>
>
>Jerry Frank - Calgary, Alberta
>jkfrank at shaw.ca 
>
>--__--__--
>
>Message: 2
>Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 22:44:42 -0700
>From: Jerry Frank <jkfrank at shaw.ca>
>Subject: Re: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Volhynian village - Slabutkaj ?
>To: Dale Mattis <dmattis at earthlink.net>, SGGEE list
>  <ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org>
>
>At 06:47 PM 14/01/2003 -0500, Dale Mattis wrote:
>
>  
>
>>I tried the sneaky route - I tried to search the St. Pete records on the
>>"pixel" by using the film number for a search term (intending to then
>>use my browser to search for the page number) - didn't work.  I'm not
>>familiar with SGGEE's database of St.  Pete records - can IT be searched
>>by film number rather than name?
>>    
>>
>
>
>Gary already answered the part about the SGGEE version.
>
>I have used a form of your "sneaky route that worked but it will take 
>time.  I manually did a browser search for 3 page numbers - the one for the 
>entry in question, and the ones immediately before and after.  I noted the 
>sequence number and associated village for all those.  You can then figure 
>out the order and solve the problem.  You will run into trouble however if 
>you have to find, for example, page #188 on film #1881234 cause it will 
>stop at every occurrence of "188".   If the sequence number is high - i.e. 
>1123 - you could search for before and after numbers.  However, this 
>doesn't work well with lower numbers as you would get too many irrelevant hits.
>
>An ideal solution would be the ability to download the file into a 
>spreadsheet where you could manipulate and sort the data in many ways.  To 
>date I have not figured out a way to do that.  The best I have come up with 
>is downloading to a word processor using 11 x 14 paper in landscape mode, 
>Courier New font type, and 10 point font size.  All the columns will line 
>up nicely if you do that.
>
>
>
>
>Jerry Frank - Calgary, Alberta
>jkfrank at shaw.ca 
>
>--__--__--
>
>Message: 3
>To: ger-poland-volhynia at eclipse.sggee.org
>Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 00:04:16 -0800
>From: JUSTIN L DINGMAN <jld4321 at juno.com>
>Subject: [Ger-Poland-Volhynia] Needs translation from German to English
>
>Hi All:
>Would SKS interpret this for me.  Thanks so much.
>Respectfully,
>Justin L Dingman
>
>--------- Forwarded message ----------
>From: Geheimes Staatsarchiv PK <gsta.pk at gsta.spk-berlin.de>
>To: jld4321 at juno.com
>Date: Tue, 14 Jan 2003 11:43:51 +0100
>Subject: 207/03e-1.3
>Message-ID: <3E23E9E7.E9C75518 at gsta.spk-berlin.de>
>
>Betr.:        Karl Johann Friedrich Lipke 
>
>
>Sehr geehrter Herr Dingman,
>
>auf Ihre Anfrage muss ich Ihnen leider mitteilen, dass |ber einen
>Unteroffizier Karl Johann Friedrich Lipke im Geheimen Staatsarchiv
>Preu_ischer Kulturbesitz nichts ermittelt werden konnte, weil das
>Preu_ische Heeresarchiv mit den zugehvrigen Truppenstammrollen im
>Zweiten  Weltkrieg zum ganz |berwiegenden Teil vernichtet worden ist. In
>den hier befindlichen Militdrkirchenb|chern mit Eintragungen von
>Geburten, Kopulationen und  Todesfdllen preu_ischer Militdrangehvriger
>kommt man nur weiter, wenn man das Regiment kennt, dem Karl Johann
>Friedrich Lipke angehvrt hat. Falls Sie das wissen, bitte ich um
>Nachricht, damit ich gezielter nachforschen kann. Dagegen habe ich in
>der Offiziernomenklatur  GStA PK, IV. HA Preu_ische Armee, Rep. 1
>Geheime Kriegskanzlei Nr. 80 einen Eintrag betr. einen Offizier Lipke
>gefunden. Die Vornamen werden leider nicht erwdhnt. 
>In ihm wird ein Bombardier Lipke genannt, der am 23. Januar 1844 zum
>Sekondelieutnenant der Artillerie im 3. Bataillon des 16.
>Landwehr-Regiments ernannt wurde. Am 18. Mai 1847 wurde er ins  3.
>Bataillon des 20. Landwehr-Regiments, am 7. Juli 1849 ins
>Landwehr-Bataillon des 38. Infanterie-Regiments  und am 12. Okt 1849 ins
>3. Bataillon des 20. Landwehr-Regiments |berstellt. Am 22. Januar 1852
>wurde er aufgrund  eines ehrengerichtlichen Erkenntnisses aus dem
>Offiziersstand entfernt.  
>
>Mit freundlichen Gr|_en
>In Vertretung
>
>( Dr. Hartmann )